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Categories » Mobile Internet Content Adaptation » I want my User-Agent String

luca
Admob.com

6/9/07 4:21 PM

I want my User-Agent String

Hi, My Name is Luca Passani and I manage the WURFL open-source project (http://wurfl.sourceforge.net).

Here is a Nokia 6288 on the vodafone UK network:

user-agent = Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US;
rv:1.8.0.7) Gecko/20060909 Firefox/1.5.0.7 MG
(Novarra-Vision/6.1)
accept = text/html;q=1.0, text/css; q=1.0,
application/x-javascript; q=1.0, text/plain;q=0.8,
application/xhtml+xml;q=0.6,
application/x-httpd-php;q=0.1, */*;q=0, image/gif;
q=1.0, image/jpeg; q=1.0, image/png; q=1.0
accept-charset = ISO-8859-1,utf-8;q=0.7,*;q=0.7
accept-language = en
accept-encoding = identity;q=1.0, gzip;q=0.1, *;q=0
x-novarra-device-type = 0
x-device-user-agent = Nokia6288/2.0 (05.94)
Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1
x-mobile-gateway = Novarra-Vision/6.1 (VF-UK;
Server-Only)
via = HTTP/1.1 glgwsl11 (XMG 724Solutions HTG
XMG-31_VODAFONE_M3_B030 20070724.091400), 1.1
Novarra (Vision/6.1), 1.1 frankenstein1:3128
(squid/2.6.STABLE9-20070214)
cache-control = max-age=259200
connection = keep-alive

How bad is this? this isn't even a Symbian phone. It's a Nokia series 40! How can you disguise this as a desktop browser?

Also, what happened to the UAprof header? that was introduced by OMA (i.e. operators and device manufacturers) explicitly to allow operators and content owners to customize their content to device capabilities. You new gateway simply removes all of that. This is an abuse. I bought my phone so that I could go to site that can send me content for my phone! what Vodafone is doing is either illegal or it SHOULD be.

What would you do if your ADSL provider was turning your HTTP requests to look like Netscape 4? you would probably change ADSL provider. Unfortunately, changing operator is not nearly a simple (too many other services that come with one's subscriptions) yet, one can only point out the arrogance.

finally, let me provide my perspective as a end-user. I may be OK going to a reformatting service for this or that site, BUT generally speaking reformatted websites are mostly unusable on feature phones, so I do not understand how you can force this on all of your users without their permission.

Dear vodafone, this is not what I call being an advanced mobile internet provider, this is about Novarra bamboozling vodafone into believing that there are shortcut to the mobile internet.

Luca

mrbgturner
Vodafone

7/9/07 10:29 AM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to luca

Hi Luca

We welcome all constructive feedback to the Betavine forum.

Vodafone as a pioneer in this area is first to launch content adaptation in the UK. Other operators have launched it in Europe and are in the process of launching it.

Please read the web pages on the site as they detail the rational behind the changes Vodafone has made.

On your specific query the WTE passes through the mobile user agent for any domain or URL on the whitelist. It also recognises and passes through mobile specific sites that are properly formatted with correct xhtml headers (Please see details on this site).

The service offers customers the ability to browse the internet on their phones and currently the early feedback and usage is very positive.

Vodafone is working with the standards bodies such as the W3C to ensure that standards will be created in this new "Content Adaptation" area.

Other Global companies are driving forward with Content Adaptation solutions with a similar mission.

You appear to be from a standards background and you are very welcome to join in the W3C debate. The topics you raised are part of the "Best Practice's " mission. Please see the link for W3C.

Best Regards
Brian

luca
Admob.com

7/9/07 11:37 PM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to mrbgturner

for the record, I do not have a standard background. I did try to work with W3C, but the way standard bodies work did not leave me too happy.
You can refer to this for details:

http://www.passani.it/gap/intro.htm

which is the background to my GAP document, which tries to give developers the right message, something that what W3C has egregiously failed to do:

http://www.passani.it/gap/

To make a long story short, it is my opinion that mixing web and mobile internet only means making mobile development even more complicated than it already is.

Anyway, I am not here to talk about me. I am here to bring my contribution and help the industry turning the mobile internet into a developer platform. Vodafone's initiatives goes into the opposite direction. *You are fragmenting the platform*.

So, you say that the comments so far are very positive. Really? you must have heard different comments than the ones I heard, because the ones I heard are very negative, and I am referring to comments from everyone I talked to, including developers, bloggers and, hear hear, people from vodafone too. Can you point to one of your positive comments? I am curious...

> Other Global companies are driving forward with
> Content Adaptation solutions with a similar mission

yeah, it's one of the many trends in the industry, but it's pretty much failing everywhere. Your regular user does not care about hitting the web with a feature phone. Too slow. Too hard to use. Can't be bothered.

Best Regards

Luca

mrbgturner
Vodafone

10/9/07 8:28 AM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to luca

Hi Luca

Re Other companies

Please see the list of companies discussing the topic at the W3C meetings. I don't want to promote other solutions as I feel it is their job to market themselves. Suffice to say they are global brands. Major players are developing and marketing content adaptation solutions. A major internet player is also using the same solution as Vodafone.

Having just left a competitor of Vodafone myself I know that they are considering (At CEO level)launching similar services but that will be up to them.

Re: The service offers customers the ability to browse the internet on their phones and currently the early feedback and usage is "very positive."

I was referring to the customer uptake and usage.

Vodafone has however taken criticism at service launch but has responded quickly to fix issues that arose after launch. Please see Issues link in this forum.

I don't agree with your comment.

"Your regular user does not care about hitting the web with a feature phone. Too slow. Too hard to use. Can't be bothered."

I am monitoring the customer usage of the service and I can tell you firmly that your statement is not the case. Customers do want to use the WWW internet and daily usage and customer volumes are increasing. The service allows any customer with a WAP2.0 handset to use it . This is not just for feature phones and probably covers more than 80% of the Vodafone customer base.

The technology is speeding up the delivery of web pages through content adaptation ,optimisation and acceleration (Network latency).

The point of this Betavine site is allow people to express their views so I welcome all constructive comments.

BR
Brian

luca
Admob.com

10/9/07 10:52 AM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to mrbgturner

Quoting: "I am monitoring the customer usage of the service and I can tell you firmly that your statement is not the case. Customers do want to use the WWW internet and daily usage and customer volumes are increasing."

Brian, Vodafone associated the launch of the adaptation framework with the one-pound per 5Megs offer, which explains the positive response by the customer.
The day you measure the popularity of sites built specifically for mobile vs generic adapted web sites AND the same cheap billing for data traffic, you will see mobile sites win hadns-down. That's assuming Vodafone has allowed developers the possibility to build mobile sites (i.e. recognize the device through the user-agent string).

Luca

mrbgturner
Vodafone

10/9/07 1:16 PM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to luca

Hi Luca

Think about the WWW market in 2-3 years time ? Think about every mobile device having the same capability as a current Nokia N95 which will come soon. Then think about starting to develop this new business. This is where Vodafone has started in the UK.

Mobile sites will co-exist. The WWW market is certain to grow and transcoding is a step to bridge the gap between "Non Internet ready devices" and a full portfolio of "Internet ready devices".

There is a technology challenge as there was with the early days with WAP. The early WAP discussions were tough (I know as I helped launch WAP) but they led to a transition and data growth in the mobile market over a 4 year period.

Companies can't move forward by standing still.

On your other comment anyone who continues to have issues we will support.

BR
Brian

rawcane

11/9/07 8:52 AM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to mrbgturner

mrbgturner:

Vodafone is working with the standards bodies such as the W3C to ensure that standards will be created in this new "Content Adaptation" area.

I feel I should point out that the area of Content Adaptation is not that new and plenty of people are handling it very well. There are always going to be phones with small screens as people will always want small easy to use phones ie not the Nokia N95 and therefore mobile sites are always going to work better if tailored for the individual handset. While its very commendable to try and make any web page viewable on a phone (although in many cases impossible), actually stopping dedicated mobile sites from being correctly viewed on a phone is unnecessary and will ruin the user experience.

Or is it that Vodafone is trying to close things off to anyone who is not 'on-portal'?

Mark

mrbgturner
Vodafone

11/9/07 10:15 AM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to rawcane

Hi Mark

Thanks for your comments.

Since the launch of the "Mobile Internet" it hasn't been Vodafone's intention to stop of block any mobile site.

This is why the whitelist was created to allow for mobile site access.

Vodafone live! remains as a Premium mobile content offering with Vodafone partners.

Customers can now go off portal which is something I personally have wanted as a customer to do for many years now and many others are now enjoying too.

We are open for suggestions in working with both web and mobile specific content.

To date we haven't had any detailed suggestions from this forum on the handling of both.

I would like this threaded discussion to move to a proactive discussion to options where mobile and web content work in harmony and not get stuck in the past of working solely with mobile specific content. That era has gone.

I welcome any technical suggestions that others have that can be debated or discussed as either features or suggestions for the standards forums.

BR
Brian

DavidHarper
Winksite

11/9/07 11:09 AM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to mrbgturner

Dear Vodafone,

Please stop now, you are crippling sites, not adapting pages.

You’re assuming way too much power in hijacking web sites and replacing them with your own version. The version of the site that you deliver will never be close to what developers and publishers want to deliver or what their audience expects to receive. Let me explain.

Your actions remove user access to mobile-specific services on which many mobile-centric businesses are based. By default, your actions censor those who provide a unique and/or useful mobile experience.

Services that respect and value the mobile audience provide mobile sites and services designed for that audience (as is the case with any media/audience.) With a bit of browser detection, Winksite and other mobile-centric services send these visitors to either mobile optimized versions of their sites or even mobile phone-specific services. By intercepting and overriding that detection, context, and delivery you do more harm then good. I question your right to do that and without permission to create a derivative work.

Vodafone’s actions bastardizes every truly mobile web site that it intercepts, violating the copyright of each and reducing all of them to a lowest common denominator that sets the mobile web back ten years.

Regards,
David Harper
Founder, Winksite
Love the Mobile Web.

luca
Admob.com

11/9/07 1:35 PM

RE: I want my User-Agent String as a reply to mrbgturner

"We are open for suggestions in working with both web and mobile specific content.
To date we haven't had any detailed suggestions from this forum on the handling of both.
I would like this threaded discussion to move to a proactive discussion to options where mobile and web content work in harmony and not get stuck in the past of working solely with mobile specific content. That era has gone."

Brian, now you are being unfair here. The suggestion has been there, very clear and very simple for you guys to implement. Let the user-agent string alone!!! it is not yours, it's never been and you have no right to change it while it travel from people's phone to developers' services. It's a theft!

The user-agent string is what developers need to provide superior user experience in their site. The message from developers is loud and clear. DO NOT TOUCH the USER-AGENT STRING!

When you say "working solely with mobile specific content" you are offending our intelligence, because Vodafone behavior is enforcing mobile adaptation *solely* and not anything else. You won't get away with this so easily by playing with words.

This is a constructive, unambiguous message you are receiving from developers around the world. Trying to change the subject won't fool anyone. You and Vodafone are guilty of arrogant and abusive behavior.

Luca Passani

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